Micromanagement Isn’t a Control Problem. It’s a Motive Problem. (Ep.24)

Shaun (00:01)

This isn’t just a podcast about leadership. It’s about the patterns that run us, the scripts we inherit, and the beliefs we reinforce without even realizing it. We’ve watched this work rekindle marriages, renew parents’ connections with their kids, and reimagine the future of businesses. So if you’ve ever found yourself asking, “Am I becoming the person I’m supposed to be?” you’re in the right place. This is “In the Arena,” conversations about what it really means to live and lead well.

Shaun (00:31)

Welcome to In the Arena. My name is Shaun Dyke, Managing Partner here with DoorTwo. I am solo piloting today. Nobody I’m interviewing, nobody we’re chatting with. Today is a fun topic. It’s a topic that I think gets overstated, overused, and it’s just become sort of like fodder in leadership language. The concept is micromanagement. In fact, I was thinking about it as I was writing this episode up and chatting through it that I just don’t even like the term. I think the term gets so misattributed to what’s actually happening inside of it. And I wanna start with removing the caricature of what is a micromanager.

Shaun (01:12)

I think on some level, people think that someone that micromanages is aggressive. They are maybe a bit of a tyrant. They have their own viewpoints and convictions that they overly inspect and analyze the work that someone else is doing. And I mean, on some level, that may be true. There may be some element that’s tied into that, but I can tell you confidently that there are really great leaders that micromanage. There are individuals that have strong understanding of a situation, and they have strong understanding of themselves. They’ve got really high EQ, but now and again, they may drop into this concept of micromanaging.

Shaun (01:55)

And on the surface, I think we oftentimes think about micromanagement as like time management or project management in some way where we’re trying to regulate or manage the work product, the physical outcome of something. And I think in the reality, it’s something that’s quite different than that.

Shaun (02:17)

I think we would kind of label it this way. We would say that on many levels, when something about the work we are doing becomes psychologically important enough that we are unwilling to allow someone else to own the outcome. State that again. Something that we’re doing, something we’re working on, a work product becomes important enough, psychologically important enough that we’re unwilling to let somebody else own the outcome. So the fun is that, is figuring out why would that be the case? Why would we do that? In what situations would we feel like we have to intervene or we have to step in because whatever transpires from this work that we’re doing, if it’s not at the standard or the level that I need it to be, that matters to me at a level that is translating into me intervening in a way that may be unhealthy or unproductive for the individuals.

Shaun (03:14)

So we’ve all probably either been in a spot where we have micromanaged or we have been micromanaged, and I think it is important to name why. Sometimes the temptation to micromanage is completely rational. Let’s say I’m in a spot where I have a significant amount of work that needs to be done. I have multiple stakeholders involved in it. I have limited resources. I have a constrained or impacted timeline. And in truth, my knowledge around this situation, the network of individuals in it, the complexity of the activities that need to be done, like I know those better than anybody else does. That isn’t an uncommon reality.

Shaun (04:00)

Oftentimes, leaders amass a knowledge set that they’re in that spot for a reason. So I’m in this spot. I’ve got this deliverable. I need to step into the situation. I’ve gotta manage it really effectively. But when I do that, I may win in the short term. May win in the short term. Like, I may get the product or the outcome that I’m looking for to happen. Our tendency in the harried pace of the world is that we feel justified and rational in intervening in work products because we can get it done faster, more efficiently, more effectively, and the outcome is more in aligned with what we want.

Shaun (04:43)

The challenge in some of that is that when we consistently take ownership back from someone else who should be owning the work product, there’s adverse consequences tied into that. I think the reminder for us in this is you can absolutely have incredibly high standards without constantly reclaiming the work. And on some level, that should be liberating for us to realize that the pressure that we apply to ourselves to control the outcome not only limits our own ability. We have 168 hours in a week. You’re not gonna be able to do everything that you wanna do.

Shaun (05:20)

So let’s explore for a second the implications of when we do it. We know very well that the environment that we create, we refer to it as climate. The organizational climate that we create is a critical determinant in people wanting to accomplish and own outcomes, people wanting to do their very best and be their very best. We also know that the greatest factor on creating that environment is the leader’s behavior. So now let’s step back.

Shaun (05:58)

If I was to ask, what does micromanaging behavior do to a climate? It does exactly the opposite of what we want. It creates conditions where people do not feel like they can materially accomplish goals and own the outcomes. So it is through the high drive of the individual, you, the micromanaging leader, that is actually suppressing the environment for everyone else to be better. It shows up completely opposite of what our desired outcome is.

Shaun (06:32)

The other challenging reality in this to take stock of for self is micromanaging can become a really self-fulfilling system. I believe that people don’t have the capability or the competence to do the thing. I intervene. They don’t get reps in building skill and capability. I once again was right that I had to step in and intervene. And by the way, it probably feels good to me. This is part of what we talk about when we talk about this concept of heroes or hero culture, where an individual has to step in to save the day. So I get this recurring dopamine hit and this value attribution to myself because, man, if I wasn’t here, I don’t know how they’d survive. We’re creating those conditions, maybe better said, we’re contributing to those conditions by consistently micromanaging.

Shaun (07:22)

So every behavior has a goal attached to it, right? We’ve said it is all behavior is purposive. If Chris was here, he would challenge me on if purposive was actually a word, and we researched it. We know it is. So this idea that all behavior is purposive. There’s a goal attached to what we’re doing. So the problem is we are frequently much more aware of the behavior than the driver of the behavior.

Shaun (07:47)

So if we try to just solve the outcome or what’s visible, then we’re attacking a symptom, not a root cause. So then how do we get at a root cause? One of the primary models that we use in this firm to understand what drives people’s behaviors is the body of work around motive theory. I’m not gonna go into that deeply, but I’m gonna scratch at three of them for us so you can think about, are these contributing to how I am showing up? And if I am micromanaging, if I am over-intervening, is it one of these that tends to show up?

Shaun (08:22)

So at its core, there’s three things that tend to drive us. Let’s just think of it this simplistically. One version is we have this high need to achieve. It’s called achievement. It is, I wanna do things bigger, better, faster, more efficiently. I wanna excel. I wanna execute. I wanna win really well. So when I’m doing a project, I have this internal thinking that’s about, man, making the best that’s ever been done or the most unique or the most innovative. I’m compelled to execute this product as fast as I can, under budget, with the most impact that anybody has ever seen before, this drive to accomplish.

Shaun (08:57)

The second one is called affiliation. This is relational drive. It’s about connecting and being with people, building relationship and harmony, establishing long-term loyalty and connection with somebody. And so as I work on this project with this individual, I’m mindful of knowing them and their reality and their world, and I’m genuinely curious and connected and loyal into that interest. And then the last one in this body of work is called power, and we directly link that to influence. It’s this idea that I wanna be influential in an outcome. I want to help a body of people see the reason behind something, be motivated around it, and then take the hill because they know that what we’re doing is gonna have a material impact and leave a legacy in some way. Right?

Shaun (09:44)

So let’s look at those again. I have this high drive to achieve better, faster, more efficiency. I have this high idea and this high desire to relate and connect through this affiliation drive, and/or I have this high drive to be really influential, to create emotion and energy in people to move toward an outcome. So it’s probable one of those three are at play in me. That underlying currency, that thought process is what can translate into the behavior people are experiencing. So if I’m really high in achievement and it’s important to me to do this quickly and fast and effectively, then my micromanagement may be just vibrating at doing that.

Shaun (10:33)

If I’m trying to relate or connect and I wanna create conditions where people feel supported, maybe I’m leaning in excessively in the work agenda with far too much connection and relationship time. Or maybe I’m in that spot where I really believe that I have to influence at such an amplified level that I can get to this outcome through these people, that I’m gonna create all these conditions tied into serving that need for myself. So the behavior is what we observe, but the motive, the underlying drivers are really what’s informing how we behave.

Shaun (11:13)

So that’s the question for you to consider. What is underlying, underscoring how I’m showing up? Because again, how you show up, if it’s through this high achievement drive, unintentionally, unconsciously, you can be creating a climate that’s actually suppressing the achievement drive in everybody else. It’s a lot of language inside of that. It simply means the way you’re behaving may actually be counterproductive to what you’re wanting. Your micromanaging style that’s informed by your needs psychologically can be creating conditions where the people that you’re leading are feeling less needed. They’re feeling disengaged. They feel like that the work they’re doing, they’re just really being hands to the puppeteer. They’re not doing anything. You’re the one guiding them and correcting and directing them.

Shaun (12:11)

So there’s a common lie that we tell ourselves, not through malice and manipulation. We don’t realize we’re doing this, but one of the most common lies associated with micromanagement is, “I don’t have time.” I don’t have the time to build the capability and the people that I’m leading, or for me to have the confidence and the competence of the people that I’m leading. And in truth, the cost of not doing it is exponentially higher. I’d have you think about it as if you feel like you can micromanage and get it done faster in this moment, then you need to recognize that you are borrowing time at an increasingly terrible interest rate.

Shaun (12:48)

The outcome, the adverse implication of that in the long term is gonna be amplified at scale. So yes, in the beginning, it maybe takes a minute more. Maybe the work product isn’t as perfect as the one that you wanted. There is discomfort in it. But if we don’t give people time and reps to build capability in that, then you’re gonna be perpetually caught in a spot where you are the bottleneck because you feel like you need to own it all the time. Your intervention is at too high of a level.

Shaun (13:19)

So then what do I do? I’m sitting here thinking to myself, “I do this. I have so many things on my plate. I have so much activity that I need to do. Where do I stop or where do I let go?” Well, one of the core things that we always say at this firm is that all growth starts with self-awareness. So first we have to acknowledge, do we do this? And if we don’t know, well, I’ll give you the solution to that in one second. First step is trying to catch the behavior for yourself. So take stock. And this isn’t a 50-minute exercise. It’s a three-minute exercise. In fact, you can do it while you’re listening right now.

Shaun (13:56)

Are there people or content areas that I tend to over-index on? I go back to it, I doubt them, I over-question, I circle back too much. Are certain people individuals that you lean in more? Are there certain content areas that you tend to lean in more? You can start to identify, are there individuals in my life or that I’m leading that I need to build, help build and develop capability in them so I don’t have that feeling state? And are there content areas that I just like to lean into more? Maybe it’s more satisfying for me. Maybe I feel better about it. Maybe I just like this idea better, so I want to jump into those. So first step is trying to recognize for yourself through self-awareness, where do I do it?

Shaun (14:41)

Self-awareness only gets us so far, though. Sometimes we need some other awareness, and that’s where vulnerability comes in, that we get to invite others to tell us. Ask your people. And you don’t ask them, “Do I micromanage?” They’re most likely gonna say no, and then that’s just gonna be reinforcing of your behavior. You get to ask things like, “Where do I lean in more than I need to?”

Shaun (15:05)

Are there scenarios where you feel like or you experience me giving you ownership, but then taking it back? So creating the scenario or a situation where you can ask folks, “Am I doing this?” And they can give you some honest guidance inside of it, ’cause it’s probable that you are. We all fall victim to it at some level.

Shaun (15:28)

There’s a phrase that I love and hate at the same time. It’s that the human attribute that invites the greatest amount of contempt is hypocrisy. And any time I’m sitting here talking about these ideas that are well-founded and well-researched and that we espouse to support and do, which we do, I then can’t help but take stock of the degree to which I’m doing it. And there’s always a say-do gap. There’s an aspirational desire, and then there’s a reality. So it is not uncommon that I will step into situations that I don’t need to. I’ll get over-involved. A lot of time it’s because it’s fun or it’s exciting or it’s energy-giving. I want to be involved in it.

Shaun (16:12)

Other times, it may be that I haven’t taken the time to create competency, and I feel like I need to be overly involved in those. And those are just feeding the states of feeling like I don’t have time or I need to prioritize differently. In those spots, one of the complicated questions we need to ask ourselves is, what am I protecting? Now, that may be something very real. Maybe you’re protecting the quality of the work product that the client, internal or external customer, is going to see. Now, I get it. That’s real. You’re feeling like you need to protect that and step in.

Shaun (16:52)

But name that, identify that, and let’s figure out how in the future you don’t have to be the one intervening in those moments. Maybe you’re protecting your identity as an expert. Maybe you’re protecting a sense of control or a perceived business risk. There’s something that is contributing to why you are doing the things that you are doing. So ask yourself, “Why is it that I feel like if I don’t intervene, this thing will happen?” And whatever the fear of this thing happening is, you can start to label that as what you’re protecting.

Shaun (17:29)

An important consideration is that we constantly find leaders frequently over-controlling to compensate for a lack of clarity. So clarity has not been created, goal or role clarity, so then the need for micromanaging and over-control is amplified.

Shaun (17:52)

So I work with this client that with all of the best intention in the world, it seems unimaginable how much he knows. He constantly has the high detail on all the product lines. He has clarity on the current state of the business, where it’s trying to go. He has this almost savant-like read on what’s going to happen, what is happening, what needs to happen. So how does that materialize? When you go to this person’s meetings, we’re talking a four-hour meeting. People have probably spent 20, 30, 40 hours in preparation of content. Decks are a hundred pages long. They come in completely armored up and prepared to be able to speak to really anything, because again, this individual’s level of knowledge is so high.

Shaun (18:50)

Now, on some level, they respect him for that, and on some level, his ability to have insight into the business and run it is, well, not on some level, it’s very unparalleled. It’s also completely unrepeatable. No one can do that, what he does. No one. Probably no one should do that. The amount of hours that are being spent in deck preparation. Well, I hope this isn’t the case for you, but I can only imagine the number of people listening that are nodding their head on how much pre-work preparation is often done in advance of internal meetings to satiate the need of some individual that is over-intervening or over-controlling so that they have the knowledge. And that’s the unfortunate part in this situation.

Shaun (19:32)

This individual is amazing, but they use these scenarios in this sort of hub and spoke model where they can acquire more and more knowledge that allows them to be a greater asset, know everything that’s going on, and in turn, it’s tying up resources all over the place to feed him knowledge. It’s tying up resources that could be being used in other ways for development, and it’s continuing to create singular reliance on one individual to make decisions around it. So an example of where the tendency, thinking that you are coming at it to make it go more efficiently, more effectively, be more knowledgeable, and have a larger impact, is translating into creating an environment where people don’t feel like they can accomplish, nor do they feel like they own the outcomes, because all of the energy and effort is being resourced to feed the ego of one individual.

Shaun (20:27)

So on some level, when I started this, I said I don’t like this concept of micromanagement, because again, I think it gets reductively identified as time management or project management, that people just have a control problem inside of it. And while that manifests that way, what I hope you’re taking away from this is that’s the visible behavior, not the underlying question. The control is helping you accomplish something psychologically. What is that?

Shaun (21:01)

Is it protecting an ego? Is it protecting your need to excel? Is it protecting or offsetting some insecurity that you feel? Taking stock of understanding why you’re demonstrating the behavior that you’re demonstrating, the adverse effect of that behavior may help you significantly in getting time back for yourself in areas that are important, and even more importantly, creating an environment where people feel like they can own the engagement and the outcome at a much higher level. Because if your team can only be excellent when you’re in the middle of everything, you didn’t build an excellent team. You’ve built an excellent dependency on you.

Shaun (21:50)

I think that’s enough for the day. Hopefully, you got some insights and perspectives that you find valuable. If you are curious about some of the concepts that we cover in this, like the ideas of underlying drivers of behavior, like motives or existential questions that drive who we are, can I encourage you to subscribe to the newsletter at doortwo.com/signup. From that, you’ll get insights and awareness of some of the topics that we discuss more deeply. Until next time.

Chris (22:23)

Thanks for joining us in “The Arena.” If you wanna keep growing, the best thing you can do is join our weekly newsletter. It’s where we break down the biggest ideas from the podcast and share the tools and frameworks we use every day to help leaders live and lead differently. You can sign up for that at doortwo.com/signup. That is D-O-O-R-T-W-O.com/signup. And if you enjoyed the conversation, make sure to follow or subscribe wherever you listen. If you prefer to watch, head over to YouTube and check out our full video episodes filmed right here in our on-site studio. And remember, all growth starts with self-awareness. We’ll see you next time in “The Arena.”